The Human League's Generations Tour is right on time
- 9 hours ago
- 12 min read
Singers Philip Oakey and Susan Ann Sulley reflect on the British group's catalogue and staying power
This iconic Sheffield, England band defined new wave looks and synth sounds for so many of us in the 1980s and beyond. Now, the Human League is back with its Generations Tour, which winds across the U.S. this month, along with Allison Moyet and Soft Cell.
The tour kicked off June 2, spans 21 dates and arrives at Atlanta's historic Fox Theatre on June 19. Joanne Catherall, Susan Ann Sulley and Philip Oakey perform those hits you love, including "Mirror Man," "Fascination," and "Don't You Want Me."
Oakey was interviewed for Georgia Public Broadcasting's summer music preview special (listen to the NPR radio feature and read the story here). And Oakey and Sulley recently joined the Sweet Song Podcast for a chat about their surprise favorites to play each night. The episode also delves into how songs like the "The Lebanon" and "Human" have taken on new significance in recent times of war and technological upheaval. Transcript has been edited for length and clarity.
Surprises on tour
Kristi York Wooten: So let's get started with an all-important sweet song question. What is the sweet song that you're enjoying performing on the tour?
Philip Oakey: I quite enjoy I enjoy a song called "Seconds" because it's it's very much very, very like the driving synthesizer music that we're known for. But we u we usually do a song called "One Man in My Heart," which I leave the stage for, I'm probably getting changed somewhere, and Susan sings and I always really enjoy that. Susan and Joanne sing that without me. It's a little bit immodest to say I like the song, because I was very much a part of the writing of that song. It feels like I did something a little bit different and in my mind it worked out.
Susan Ann Sulley: Sometimes we call it the "toilet song" (laughs). It's where Philip goes to get changed, and lots of people just think, 'We're not gonna listen to her, we're gonna go to the bathroom.' So Joanne and I have laughed many times calling it that. But I think what "One Man" is good for us, it it shows a little bit of light and shade within the group. It's not just all about Philip doing the vocals, you know, in the same way that, you know, I I sing half half a verse in "Don't You Want Me" and the same way Joanne does in "Human." And I think you know, it it's about the three of us.
When old songs find new relevance
Kristi York Wooten: One of the things that's been striking me this week as I was preparing for the interview and going back and listening to the albums, is how I felt about the songs then and what they meant to me now. And I couldn't help but listening to your 1984 song, "The Lebanon," again. And my goodness, it sounds like it's from right now. I know that the Human League was never an overtly political band, but talk to me a little bit about the power of lyrics. You know, they're there forever, you know, once you commit to recording and they really, you know, can reverberate in different times. That's gotta be kind of an interesting thing to think about when you look back on that song in particular.
Philip Oakey: That was just something that was was going along. It was named sort of in reference to a song by Siouxsie and the Banshees. They had done a song called "Israel" and one of our songwriters, Joe Callis, just piped up and said, "Look, they've done one called 'Israel.' We could do one called 'The Lebanon.' And there had just been the couple of massacres in in Lebanon and we were, more than anything, baffled, I think because we don't really understand how we keep being in the same position. I had hoped that things would be getting more and more peaceful. We're we're very ordinary, run-of-the-mill people and we always get upset that the people who get hurt in wars, the conflicts where big guys play out their ambitions, are always the ordinary people. We don't take sides or anything really. I don't think you can in a group. I think there were six of us in the band when we wrote that, and I couldn't possibly write down lyrics that that that said what everyone in the band thought. But it it's just that. my God, can't we somehow learn to talk before we we fight?
Kristi York Wooten: Right. And I'm just driving around Atlanta going to a meeting, listening to the song and it's like "we're supposed to keep the peace." Hearing that line [now], I was like, my goodness, that's exactly how I feel.
Susan Ann Sulley: I think "The Lebanon" is really about the small people that get left behind and people don't talk about so much in war. It's about someone who who loses their home and who doesn't know where to go, with all the things that go on around you. And it's the the small people. That's what it's about, and yes, it does resonate, and it's a a terrible time [in the world] at the moment.
How technology shaped music in the 1980s versus 2026
Kristi York Wooten: There's so much talk of what being human means in the age of AI and how all the 1980s music was supposedly so futuristic and now that technology really is coming to pass. But the name Human League and then the song "Human", I do think there's an interesting echo there, that you're named after being human. Have you thought about that and the the meaning of your band name in an age like this?
Philip Oakey: I think we knew about the contrast that obviously people were gonna accuse us of being overly mechanical. We believed at the time that we thought if we gave had quite a mechanical sort of robotic backing, that the contrast would be that the voice really stood out from it and and revealed that it i it wasn't really organized, and it reflected sort of our our human very often our human failings. But but that was the idea. We knew we'd give people headlines like, "So these people think they're human, don't they?" In fact, once, a big game show host on T V in Britain, just when we rose to fame, one of his gags as he came out was he said, "Have you seen the Human League? If that's human, I don't want to be human!" And we thought, "Great, that's worked."
Kristi York Wooten: I would feel the opposite today. I think the opposite would be true. [Your music] would totally feel human and I'm sure it does.
Susan Ann Sulley: It's funny, I think maybe I don't know, maybe two or three years after, maybe a little longer, but suddenly you saw Bon Jovi on T V programs playing synthesizers and and groups like that. I'm not saying him per se, I'm just saying groups like that used to make fun of us. And, like you said, they always said [the music] was inhuman, it was improper because it was coming out of a machine. And now, well I think I think there's there's a a place for AI, but it scares me when I f I find that I hear a record and and I think, "I know that that's not a real person that's done that." And that it frightens me for for artists, especially young up-and-coming artists. One of the things I loved about music when I was small and when I was growing up was I loved the imperfect. I loved the fact that the the songs, the singers and the groups that I liked would never have got through any of those music talent shows because they weren't the best, they weren't the logical singers. And I think that's one of the problems with AI is that it's also perfect. And music shouldn't be about perfection. It should be about the little flaws, I think.
How working with Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis transformed their careers
Kristi York Wooten: And then there's the 1986 song "Human," too, and you working with Jimmy Jam, Terry Lewis. When that record when that record came out, that was a whole new world for you all because you ended up on urban radio and other things with that song. Do you want to talk about the song a little bit?
Philip Oakey: Well, sure. You are reminding me of a magic time in our life. In our working life, one of the one of the most exotic things, and it's not gonna sound like it to you, was to go for three or four months in Minneapolis. We're just we're very ordinary people from the north of England and to go to an urban studio, work with guys we didn't know but who who we really, really admired, and to be treated hospitably by them and have our careers saved. We were in a little bit of a a spiritual mess at that stage. We'd had some big hits round the world and I I think we all just got ourselves into a state we couldn't really write a whole album's worth of of good songs. So we walked walked in to Jimmy and Terry's studio. Jimmy and Terry listened to this stuff, and Jimmy said, "Well you've not got a whole album here. We'll do some for you. We've got a ballad." And he played us the backing to "Human," and I sort of had a sharp intake of breath. I'm not a huge ballad fan. I always said I don't want to do a ballad unless it's as good as "You've Lost That Loving Feeling." But even when we heard the backing, we knew that there was something absolutely tremendous. There's been like three or four points in our career where we could easily have just had to give up. You know, I I'd be driving a cab or working in a bookshop now. But because of the intervention of of people like Jimmy and Terry, we managed to get through.
Susan Ann Sulley: The group was falling apart. It wasn't very good at the time and and Ian and Philip and myself were listening to a group called Change. And Simon Draper, the managing director of of the record company, he asked everyone who they wanted to work with. And we we said Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis, but we thought "They'll never work with us. We're a synth pop group from the north of Sheffield." They were only just finishing Janet [Jackson's album] when we went to work with them. They were looking for a a group to cross over and they absolutely loved "Fascination." It was never about "Don't You Want Me" with them. It was always about "Fascination." And they wrote "Human." It was there and they saved us at that point, I have to say. They were incredible to work with. I've lots of great memories and I mean, you know, we met Prince and it was just fabulous. They were an in they were an inspiration. And and more importantly, I've got to say, they were two of the loveliest men I've ever met.
Memories of Atlanta
Most bands, especially coming out of Britain at the time, were lineups of four or five guys or, you know, like Wham had backing singers, but you all were different because people did take turns with the vocals and it felt inclusive to women in the way the B-52's did. You all kind of came out in the late 1970s. I they might have been a year or two ahead of you, but did you have any realization or recognition of that band when you were first formed as the Human League?
Philip Oakey: Do you know? I don't know that anyone has ever compared us to the the B-52's. And I'm now trying to think, because obviously they had the Rock Lobster sort of side. And I I very clearly remember really enjoying that in a club called The Limit in Sheffield. And I can't remember if it was before we started or not. We have toured with them. We did a co-tour, maybe eight or ten years ago, because we love the B-52's and we thought that was a really good line up, and we have always been very conscious that we have women and men in the band. The comparison I most normally bring up at this stage is Fleetwood Mac (laughs). Although, you know, they're about a hundred times as popular and good as us. So maybe I shouldn't I shouldn't say that.
Kristi York Wooten: No, it is actually a good comparison, because of all the different vocals. And the reason I brought up the B-52's is not that you all sound the same, but they did have an interesting parallel because, you know, Nile Rogers kind of intervened in their career the same way that Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis did for you guys. So that's that's interesting. And of course the B-52's being from Athens, Georgia, so a lot of those folks that will be driving to your show may come from Athens. I know it's difficult to ask artists to remember back, and all the cities blend together and that kind of thing, but do you have any memories of being in Atlanta over the years?
Philip Oakey: I'm afraid that I'm I'm a little bit mercenary in things. And I think the thing that I remember about Atlanta is we were there one time, and I went into a shopping mall. And it seemed to be the poshest, most expensive, most exclusive shopping mall I'd ever been into and I thought, "Wow, this must be the the most expensive flash shopping mall in the world." And I think I went across the road and there was another shopping mall that was just as expensive. Is that right? Isn't that Atlanta?
Kristi York Wooten: That's a very good memory. And it's funny, a lot of the British artists say that. You know, the malls are still across the street from each other. Of course, shopping mall experiences have changed because of online shopping and Amazon and all those. But yes, you have a very good memory, that likely did happen. I'm sure you had a great time shopping there.
Philip Oakey: It was more how designer-y the malls were. The stuff was absolutely top end. I mean, we knew that Atlanta was a huge hub, obviously the air hub. And through through talking to Jimmy and Terry, we knew that it's very much of a sports hub, isn't it? And that draws quite a rich crowd and and and has made it a very rich town, I think.
Kristi York Wooten: It's it's definitely got both sides. I'll tell you that. Which is something we need to work on as a city.
Philip Oakey: But haven't we all nowadays?
Kristi York Wooten: Yeah, it's the income disparities.
Philip Oakey: The town we come from, Sheffield is very famous as having one of the biggest income disparities in the UK, actually. We ponder on that, I've gotta say.
Kristi York Wooten: Yeah, I mean and so many films about Sheffield present that as well.
What The Human League hopes new audiences discover in their music
Kristi York Wooten: So for the younger audiences, when somebody comes to your music in 2026, what do you hope they take away?
Philip Oakey: Well, I think that in in a strange way, because our instrumentation was new, everyone thought that we were a bit revolutionary. I don't think we were. We were maybe the last generation that really valued old-fashioned song structures. You know, that our songs have almost always got an an an introduction, verses, choruses and a middle-eight and things, and I I sort of think we crystallized that sort of thing. I think the other thing about us is that we are we definitely really are a pop rock band. When a lot of people got embarrassed about doing it and people were sort of getting a bit grungy. And, you know, people like Nirvana, who I actually love but were sort of making a making a joke of the idea and the look of it. We don't. We're a pop band. We wanted to be a pop band since 1977 ish because we loved an English band called Roxy Music. That's our prime thing, but we loved David Bowie and so on. And from then, we wanted to be a pop band and we're still a pop band.
Susan Ann Sulley: The reason why we're still going after all these years, after all this time, is because it's about the songs. It's not necessarily about us. The songs are great. The people that wrote the songs, you know, Philip and Joe and Ian and Adrian and then Russell and loads of all the people that we've worked with. The songs are great. I'd like to think that people don't think they're preachy songs. They're just about ordinary people. Like you were talking about the Lebanon, they're about the ordinary folk. And I think that that resonates with people. And I think that's what it's about, the songs. It's not about us.
Kristi York Wooten: Thank you so much for this time and I will definitely be at the show. I wish you all safe travels and good health.
Susan Ann Sulley: Thank you very much, Kristi. It's nice to talk to you.
Philip Oakey: Nice to talk to you, Kristi
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